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#1 2011-10-05 11:51:14

ArchVortex
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From: Ts’elxweyeqw, Canada
Registered: 2011-04-01
Posts: 1,465

LXDE in process of being relegated to AUR

This really pisses me off  mad that no TU/Dev would pick up LXDE after Angel Velasquez orphaned the complete LXDE. I've found LXDE a fast low memory footprint replacement to the bloated 3 (Gnome, KDE, XFCE) especially after Gnome announced it's plans for Gnome3. It is quite configurable and functional even though it lacks all the glitz of the big boys.

Arch keeps finding ways of pissing me off and I think I'm going to switch the new family laptop to Gentoo + LXDE just like my box or maybe with OB this weekend. I need to research OB on a Gentoo system. I run ArchBang on my personal laptop and I hope that's not going to change in the near future.


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#2 2011-10-05 12:17:43

oliver
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Registered: 2010-11-04
Posts: 2,209

Re: LXDE in process of being relegated to AUR

but wouldn't it just take a user to adopt it, get 10 votes, and then it would be back in Community?

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#3 2011-10-05 13:44:21

ArchVortex
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From: Ts’elxweyeqw, Canada
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Posts: 1,465

Re: LXDE in process of being relegated to AUR

Allan's suggestion was that if no TU/Dev picked it up quickly, all of LXDE will be sent to AUR. The only hope would be if someone adopted all the packages and made a private repo. I thought about it for a second and a half. Gentoo has a project team for LXDE with developers, goals and encourages participation. Arch has.....banishment to AUR


You have the capacity to learn from mistakes. You'll learn a lot today.
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#4 2011-10-05 14:22:26

Mr Green
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Registered: 2010-11-07
Posts: 6,920

Re: LXDE in process of being relegated to AUR

It does bother me that packages are being dropped

Is a lack of devs, maintainers or beer?

Would having an Archbang repo be a pain the butt?

You could always hack a script to load Lubuntu packages.....

What is next Openbox?


Comments, suggestions please feel free to contact me mrgreen(at)archbang(dot)org

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#5 2011-10-05 17:30:28

oliver
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Registered: 2010-11-04
Posts: 2,209

Re: LXDE in process of being relegated to AUR

but what is the alternative?  How do you make someone adopt the packages?

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#6 2011-10-05 22:43:00

ArchVortex
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From: Ts’elxweyeqw, Canada
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Posts: 1,465

Re: LXDE in process of being relegated to AUR

@oliver, you're right, you can't make someone adopt the packages. One of the TU's would have picked it up if they had the time or desire to.

@ Mr Green, I would think it's a lack of desire to expand the numbers of Trusted Users and Developers, probably for financial reasons. And lack of beer of course wink

I think that the main three, KDE, Gnome, XFCE, will eventually be the only three in the Arch extra/community repos. Anything else in the main repos will be relegated to AUR. Openbox is part of the LXDE group and only has a chance if Brad favors or uses it and is willing to keep it in extra/community rather than keeping it together with the rest of the LXDE packages. Lightweight DE's are still a niche and with newer computers being able to run the bloated 3 easily, lightweights will never have the popularity that those three share.

The script to make the ArchBang .iso allows pulling packages from AUR so even if OB was dumped down to AUR, that's not a problem for now. Orphaned packages are a problem and as suggested previously by AB users in the Forums, maybe it is time to start a repo and maintain our own set of important packages/scripts in case something happens up in Arch Land that could cause problems in AB. The problem with maintaining a repo and packages is it requires people's time. At some point, good will and donation of free time of contributors eventually gives way to some kind of compensation to those people. Donations would need to be solicited. And at that point, the fun little distro named ArchBang becomes a serious distro with paid employees and is that what Will wants or envisioned for his project?


You have the capacity to learn from mistakes. You'll learn a lot today.
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#7 2011-10-06 08:20:53

pablokal
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From: Nijmegen, Holland
Registered: 2010-10-12
Posts: 3,633
Website

Re: LXDE in process of being relegated to AUR

so even if OB was dumped down to AUR

Will never happen because openbox is the most popular floating desktop manager among Arch users.
That is something quite different from wanting or providing a more complete desktop ensemble/environment that LXDE offers.
I think that lxde is experienced by most Arch devs as a superfluous initiative. Let everybody put together what they like.
It goes a bit against the notion that everyone should build a system himself.
I like to do it this way too.  Leafpad yes, pcmanfm no (pcmanafm-mod), lxlauncher no (dmenu yes), lxpanel no (tint2 yes) etc. Can somebody explain to me what is the problem?

maybe it is time to start a repo and maintain our own set of important packages/scripts in case something happens up in Arch Land that could cause problems in AB. The problem with maintaining a repo and packages is it requires people's time. At some point, good will and donation of free time of contributors eventually gives way to some kind of compensation to those people. Donations would need to be solicited. And at that point, the fun little distro named ArchBang becomes a serious distro with paid employees and is that what Will wants or envisioned for his project?

Seems totally unnecessary to me to start a repo. Everybody can put a package in Aur, so lets use Aur when we want something that we can't find yet. Let's keep it simple as long we can.


Getting your questions answered here at ArchBang Forums
Please! Always give hardware info, if there is a chance that 's relevant: #lspci -vnn
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#8 2011-10-06 08:27:02

scjet
Member
From: Canada
Registered: 2010-12-01
Posts: 1,468

Re: LXDE in process of being relegated to AUR

WoW !
This is absolute nutz on Arch's part to let lxde GO LIKE THIS.
OH, wait a minute.
I just downloaded the latest "64-bit Lubuntu" which, you guessed it, is chock full of 64-bit LXDE goodness gracious, including pcmanfm,..., ... but it's really  slooooow sad.
I forgot just how efficiently fast Arch is. My Arch+KDE is faster then Lubuntu.

anyway,  so wtf is this ?.
Exclusiveity now ?, just becuase UBUNTU picked up Lubuntu ?, LXDE wanna make sure it only run's great on uBUMtu !?
huh ?

Gawd I hope LXDE on Arch is just in a temporary state of Flux (hehe - no pun intended).
I sure hope Arch will KEEP LXDE, and NOT just in /AUR thankyou.

Last edited by scjet (2011-10-06 08:47:37)

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#9 2011-10-06 08:29:38

Mr Green
Administrator
Registered: 2010-11-07
Posts: 6,920

Re: LXDE in process of being relegated to AUR

Trouble is where will it end? First window managers then what?

If I want to run and build from AUR I would install Gentoo [shivers!!!]

The very reason I left Gentoo in the first place

Maybe I should buy devs a beer but Arch stopped donations a while ago


Comments, suggestions please feel free to contact me mrgreen(at)archbang(dot)org

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#10 2011-10-06 08:34:26

scjet
Member
From: Canada
Registered: 2010-12-01
Posts: 1,468

Re: LXDE in process of being relegated to AUR

Mr Green wrote:

Trouble is where will it end? First window managers then what?

If I want to run and build from AUR I would install Gentoo [shivers!!!]

The very reason I left Gentoo in the first place

Maybe I should buy devs a beer but Arch stopped donations a while ago

Unless of course you want to donate 7" Androids ?  :\
(scary future's).
smile

Last edited by scjet (2011-10-06 08:34:49)

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#11 2011-10-06 08:37:37

scjet
Member
From: Canada
Registered: 2010-12-01
Posts: 1,468

Re: LXDE in process of being relegated to AUR

pablokal wrote:

so even if OB was dumped down to AUR

Will never happen because openbox is the most popular floating desktop manager among Arch users.
That is something quite different from wanting or providing a more complete desktop ensemble/environment that LXDE offers.
I think that lxde is experienced by most Arch devs as a superfluous initiative. Let everybody put together what they like.
It goes a bit against the notion that everyone should build a system himself.
I like to do it this this way too.  Leafpad yes, pcmanfm no (pcmanafm-mod), lxlauncher no (dmenu yes), lxpanel no (tint2 yes) etc. Can somebody explain to me what is the problem?

maybe it is time to start a repo and maintain our own set of important packages/scripts in case something happens up in Arch Land that could cause problems in AB. The problem with maintaining a repo and packages is it requires people's time. At some point, good will and donation of free time of contributors eventually gives way to some kind of compensation to those people. Donations would need to be solicited. And at that point, the fun little distro named ArchBang becomes a serious distro with paid employees and is that what Will wants or envisioned for his project?

Seems totally unnecessary to me to start a repo. Everybody can put a package in Aur, so lets use Aur when we want something that we can't find yet. Let's keep it simple as long as we can.


Yes, I hope AUR does not become a weird Canonical.

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#12 2011-10-06 08:39:22

scjet
Member
From: Canada
Registered: 2010-12-01
Posts: 1,468

Re: LXDE in process of being relegated to AUR

archvortex wrote:

This really pisses me off  mad that no TU/Dev would pick up LXDE after Angel Velasquez orphaned the complete LXDE. I've found LXDE a fast low memory footprint replacement to the bloated 3 (Gnome, KDE, XFCE) especially after Gnome announced it's plans for Gnome3. It is quite configurable and functional even though it lacks all the glitz of the big boys.

Arch keeps finding ways of pissing me off and I think I'm going to switch the new family laptop to Gentoo + LXDE just like my box or maybe with OB this weekend. I need to research OB on a Gentoo system. I run ArchBang on my personal laptop and I hope that's not going to change in the near future.

Yes, but if Gentoo does the same, then it'll be all the way back to FreeBSD(actually the BSD's are ok, just a shortage of some drivers',...)  -Lol.
Ok, it's not that bad yet.

Last edited by scjet (2011-10-06 08:40:51)

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#13 2011-10-06 08:41:43

pablokal
Administrator
From: Nijmegen, Holland
Registered: 2010-10-12
Posts: 3,633
Website

Re: LXDE in process of being relegated to AUR

Trouble is where will it end? First window managers then what?

Mr.Green, you let yourself get carried away.
No, window manager is dropped, a window environment is dropped.
Essential difference. Nothing blocks you from recreating it.
I agree it is not user friendly. But that is no argument in the Arch devs book.


Getting your questions answered here at ArchBang Forums
Please! Always give hardware info, if there is a chance that 's relevant: #lspci -vnn
On Arch(bang) and Openbox: http://stillstup.blogspot.com/

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#14 2011-10-06 08:48:59

Mr Green
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Registered: 2010-11-07
Posts: 6,920

Re: LXDE in process of being relegated to AUR

Sorry I panicked smile ..... It is an argument most people do not want to build from source [I for one!] Gave up building kernels because as soon as I built it, it was out of date....


Comments, suggestions please feel free to contact me mrgreen(at)archbang(dot)org

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#15 2011-10-06 09:34:34

ArchVortex
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From: Ts’elxweyeqw, Canada
Registered: 2011-04-01
Posts: 1,465

Re: LXDE in process of being relegated to AUR

pablokal wrote:

Let's keep it simple as long we can.

Totally 100% agreed!! A repo would/should still be a ways off with AUR available.

Forgot how easy installing an Arch system is and adding a DE (ArchBang obviously easier) when compared to Gentoo. Started installing from the 20110927 minimal but stopped and did a quick and dirty with the 11.2 DVD and http://www.gentoo-wiki.info/HOWTO_Light … rom_LiveCD. I don't recommend this unless you have Gentoo experience. This is now the third Gentoo system running in the house leaving ArchBang the only none 'too system left. "Flags??? We don't need no stinkin' flags!!!


You have the capacity to learn from mistakes. You'll learn a lot today.
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#16 2011-10-06 23:39:00

Mr Green
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Registered: 2010-11-07
Posts: 6,920

Re: LXDE in process of being relegated to AUR

http://lifehacker.com/5847373/lubuntu-b … ed-desktop

Seems someone likes LXDE 'ideal for netbooks', he does mention Arch as being faster but more difficult to install....

Certainly he needs to know about Archbang


Comments, suggestions please feel free to contact me mrgreen(at)archbang(dot)org

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#17 2011-10-09 02:49:35

Mr Green
Administrator
Registered: 2010-11-07
Posts: 6,920

Re: LXDE in process of being relegated to AUR

https://www.archlinux.de/?page=PackageStatistics

Ran pkgstats this morning then went and took a look at the above, interesting seems thunar is waaay more popular than pcmanfm


Comments, suggestions please feel free to contact me mrgreen(at)archbang(dot)org

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#18 2011-10-09 03:01:36

ArchVortex
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From: Ts’elxweyeqw, Canada
Registered: 2011-04-01
Posts: 1,465

Re: LXDE in process of being relegated to AUR

That would make sense as there are a lot more users with XFCE than LXDE. As 2GB to 4GB RAM are now almost the norm in new computers, it makes it easier to run all the eye-candy and bloated desktops, and having to worry about low memory footprint will become a thing of the past except for a small group of users hanging on to their old computers..


You have the capacity to learn from mistakes. You'll learn a lot today.
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#19 2011-10-09 08:05:01

Mr Green
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Registered: 2010-11-07
Posts: 6,920

Re: LXDE in process of being relegated to AUR

More ram does not always equal more speed....

Would it help pcmanfm if all Archbang users ran pkgstats, with pcmanfm loaded of course?


Comments, suggestions please feel free to contact me mrgreen(at)archbang(dot)org

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#20 2011-10-09 08:32:18

ArchVortex
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From: Ts’elxweyeqw, Canada
Registered: 2011-04-01
Posts: 1,465

Re: LXDE in process of being relegated to AUR

I don't think it would. How many users have ttf-ms-fonts and it still sits relegated in AUR? It's become unimportant in the eyes of the Arch TU's "and so it shall now remain a lowly peon in the realm of AUR." (done in my best low narrative voice)

18.15% isn't bad but Thunar is almost double at 34.81%


You have the capacity to learn from mistakes. You'll learn a lot today.
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#21 2011-10-09 09:08:04

Mr Green
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Registered: 2010-11-07
Posts: 6,920

Re: LXDE in process of being relegated to AUR

They will soon get bored with candy..... but the page is interesting reading none the less


Comments, suggestions please feel free to contact me mrgreen(at)archbang(dot)org

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#22 2011-10-09 11:15:34

ArchVortex
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From: Ts’elxweyeqw, Canada
Registered: 2011-04-01
Posts: 1,465

Re: LXDE in process of being relegated to AUR

And there go the rest of LXDE:

2011/10/9 Ángel Velásquez <angvp@archlinux.org>:
Hi people,

I've been orphaning a list of packages in the few days, but I do want
to find a maintainer first before orphaning them (*tsk* *tsk* for
non-TU maybe if you're interested in some of them is time to apply to
be a TU big_smile).

Reasons to orphaning these packages are enough like (I don't need or
won't use them on the near future, or I stopped recently to follow the
development of them for whatever reason), so, if none of the TUs are
interested on these packages and nobody wants to be a TU in order to
maintain them, they will unfortunately go to AUR waiting for a new
maintainer.

Some of them have opened bugs, are out of date, please if you think in
adopt those packages is not just "bump the pkgrel" .. please take care
of the bugs, updates, patches, etc.

The mentioned list is:

ctpl
eclipse-emf
eclipse-gef
eclipse-mylyn
eclipse-phpeclipse
eclipse-subclipse
eclipse-ve
geany
geany-plugins
lxappearance
lxdm
lxlauncher
lxpanel
lxsession
lxtask
lxterminal
perl-linux-pid
pidgin-musictracker
pidgin-otr
tora

Thanks

--
Angel Velásquez
angvp @ irc.freenode.net
Arch Linux Developer / Trusted User
Linux Counter: #359909
http://www.angvp.com


You have the capacity to learn from mistakes. You'll learn a lot today.
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#23 2011-10-17 20:48:49

willxtreme
The Cook
From: Longueuil, Quebec, Canada
Registered: 2010-10-06
Posts: 275

Re: LXDE in process of being relegated to AUR

I'm glad pcmanfm is back in community smile

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#24 2011-10-17 21:17:39

ArchVortex
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From: Ts’elxweyeqw, Canada
Registered: 2011-04-01
Posts: 1,465

Re: LXDE in process of being relegated to AUR

Thanks for that Will! One of the 2 new TU's has picked it up and the rest of LXDE. Hooray!!


You have the capacity to learn from mistakes. You'll learn a lot today.
FP:E5F8 7DBA 8128 9ACB 75F7 7279 BE34 AB66 76D9 16DE
KEY ID:76D916DE
Currently running ArchBang / LFS / OpenSUSE Tumbleweed

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#25 2011-10-28 15:37:35

ArchVortex
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From: Ts’elxweyeqw, Canada
Registered: 2011-04-01
Posts: 1,465

Re: LXDE in process of being relegated to AUR

Openbox will change to another TU as Brad Fanella has resigned his position. The good news, for me at least, is that LXDE will definitely be staying in the main package database and not relegated to AUR. Happy dance!!


You have the capacity to learn from mistakes. You'll learn a lot today.
FP:E5F8 7DBA 8128 9ACB 75F7 7279 BE34 AB66 76D9 16DE
KEY ID:76D916DE
Currently running ArchBang / LFS / OpenSUSE Tumbleweed

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#26 2011-11-05 06:30:17

Colonel Panic
Member
Registered: 2011-09-08
Posts: 32

Re: LXDE in process of being relegated to AUR

ArchVortex wrote:

Openbox will change to another TU as Brad Fanella has resigned his position. The good news, for me at least, is that LXDE will definitely be staying in the main package database and not relegated to AUR. Happy dance!!

Good to read this. I couldn't use Mint 11 at all if it didn't have LXDE; it's an excellent lightweight desktop environment.

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